Hey it’s me, Destin. Welcome back to Smarter Every Day. At the Kodak Film Factory in Rochester, New York, we get to film how Kodak photography film is made. This is the third of three videos, and in the first video we looked at the backing. We learned about films with Estar backing and the incredible engineering involved in taking plastic pellets and melting them in an auger, extruding and stretching it out and cooling it over a continuous process. We also learned about an accumulator, which is an arrangement of pulleys that spread out to collect material inside the production line without having to stop the extrusion from the auger.

In the second video, we took the wide roll that was made and applied a light sensitive coating to it with a laminar flow waterfall. We also looked at how multiple layers were applied in special kettles in the dark. After the coatings were applied, they had to go dry it over a mile of conveyance still happening in the dark, and were moved around with nineties era robots.

Now, before we start, the most important thing to remember is that the film we’re going to be dealing with already has that light sensitive coating on it, so we have to keep everything in the dark until the shutter is allowed to open and expose the image. We’re also going to take film photos throughout the process.

We’re going to start at the Slitter, and meet Tim, the operator of the slitter. He can literally do this with his eyes shut. It comes in to the cover lifter, which takes the cover off the casket. Once that’s off, the roll is checked and the buttons are hit to automatically load onto the slitter. One of these large caskets holds 12,000 feet, and this slitter usually does the full roll. Destin: And it’s about five feet per 35 millimeter roll. Is that right, did I get that right?

Tim: Yeah.

Destin: That’s right. All right. So this is Patrick. Patrick’s an engineer.

Patrick: Nice to meet ya.

Destin: Doing all right?

Tim: This is the unwind. So we put it on the unwind, thread it up. There’ll be a leader in the machine.

Destin: Is this PET or is this acetate? This is Estar.

Destin: Okay, Estar. Got it.

Tim: Yes. So you’ve got your two banks. You got your even and your odd bank. This is a 35 millimeter slitter only.

Destin: So you have tension on one side on the whole sheet, which is right here. This is a whole sheet going.

Tim: Everything’s got tension.

Destin: Everything’s got tension?

Tim: Yeah. These are pulling tensions. See these spinning?

Destin: They’re spinning right now? Oh wow!

Tim: Yes. Yeah.

Destin: Okay. So is this actually moving leader through right now?

Tim: No.

Destin: Okay.

Patrick: I have clutches underneath those pullers.

Destin: Directional clutches.

Patrick: Yeah.

Destin: Oh, that’s how you maintain tension?

Patrick: Yes.

Destin: Gotcha. Okay, I’m with you. That’s cool. So, you know, Tim, you know everything about this machine?

Tim: More than anyone else.

Destin: Yeah? So is Tim, is Tim the guy?

Patrick: He’s the guy.

Destin: So are you an engineer? What’s your title?

Tim: No, I’m just an operator.

Destin: I didn’t mean to offend you by calling you an engineer. So he’s an engineer. So you’re basically teaching him?

Patrick: Yes. Oh, yeah.

Destin: Yeah. That’s how that works, isn’t it? Like every manufacturing job I’ve ever been in, the operators teach the engineers. That’s the way it works. That’s awesome.

Tim: So you’ve got, you know, that’s the even when you got the odd bank over there. So this is basically the the odd bank, they’re all stuck down and then you got your salvage edges going to the

Destin: Recycle?

Tim: Those are just waste.

Destin: And so you go get the silver out of that somewhere.

Tim: Yes. Yeah.

Destin: Okay. And that’s where they knurled that over on the estar line.

Tim: Correct.

Destin: So since this the slitting machine is so big, we can only see it in pieces. This is what we’re looking at as a whole. We get a big roll of film unwinding and being fed into the machine. It goes up and over and down to a series of blades that slit and send half the film to the odd side and half of the film to the even side to be rolled up. The edges are trimmed off and then sent over to a bin so they can be recycled. So up until this process, you know, after we did the photosensitive coating, everybody’s been worried about touching that side. But here it looks like I’ve got a roller. That is it coming in contact here on the other side?

Patrick: Yup, yeah. So we touch the emulsion in this, in this building only, mainly, because it’s actually dried at this point. Right. By the time it gets to us, it’s no longer just a wet, wet emulsion, it’s got some stiffness to it. So we’re, we’re allowed to actually roll and wind on that side.

Destin: So do you have night vision goggles in here?

Tim: Yes.

Destin: [With surprise in his voice] What?!

Tim: I’ve been working in the dark for almost 30 years, so it’s it’s nothing. So, you can actually see fairly decent. I could see him in the dark, but you go over to a K3 Slitter where they do that film there, you know, the 135 that… You know, you can’t see me from me to you. We are sending 500-foot rolls of estar out of this room. The rolls are slit, and then they go through the automated handling system. The rolls build up to 12,000 feet, and then they go out of the racking and down the hallway. There is a whole automated system to handle these rolls. Once the machine starts, we can see the cards come in underneath the rolls. We have tension controls and a web steer to keep the web centered. The web then goes through the knives and then up to the rewinds. It is then filled up on each side and a splice is done with double sided splice tape. This is done in the dark, and when the splice is running, we can see the arms come up and hear the tape going through the rollers. The splice is marked with white markers to identify it. Destin asked Tim if he could understand the confusion on his face. Tim replied that it all makes sense once you see it. Patrick then walked Destin a few steps away to a huge assembly, the slitting machine blades. Patrick explained that they use two different processes in the building: shear straight through slitting, and the process where they wrap around the lower roller. He said that the film runs straight through and makes contact with the roller, which has a sharp edge, and goes around and comes out another way, making about 100 degrees of contact before it gets out. Destin thanked Patrick and said that this episode of Smarter Every Day is sponsored by Nord VPN. He then shared a story about VPNs (virtual private networks). My grandfather had a unique strategy for bargaining: he would wear an old, tattered shirt when he went to buy a car or other big-ticket items. This way, the salesperson wouldn’t assume he could afford more expensive items.

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Matt: So yeah.
Destin: So this is where you put the core over here?
Matt: Well, to be honest with you, what happens is this door here would be open. As you said, we’re in a dark environment. This door would be open. There’s an arm that will reach into the rack, bring the roll in and automatically load it.
Destin: Okay.
Matt: Then this arm comes down. It puts all the computer information that we need to produce this roll.
Destin: How does how does the arm know the computer information?
Matt: Well it downloads from the actual rack.
Destin: Okay, got it.
Matt: There’s a card on the rack.
Destin: Got it.
Matt: That’ll be read and then its sent into the computer. It’s going to know that it’s a 2000 foot wall. 4000 foot or 6000 foot.
Destin: Okay.
Matt: The customer has different demand and it’s also going to tell it what print to put on there.
Destin: This looks very complicated.
Matt: That’s just the nuts and bolts of it is it’s very complicated. But for an operator’s point of view, it’s really not that difficult.
Destin: Okay.
Matt: There’s only a couple of interactions I actually have with the machine. Everything else is automated.
Destin: Can you show me what they are?
Matt: Yeah. What I’m gonna do. So this is exactly how the roll would have been loaded in under a dark environment. So as an operator, I’m going to take this tape off because we don’t want that. So this chopped it. And what we want is a rounded edge because we don’t want to damage the heart.
Destin: Okay, So a rounded edge and so it’s a very specific.
Matt: Very specific cut.
Destin: Oh, a rounded edge. Yeah, okay, got it.
Matt: We don’t want this going through the heart on the other end.
Destin: Okay.
Matt: Because of the chance when it splices through it will damage the heart.
Destin: So that was a vacuum right there.
Matt: Yeah. Holding it down.
Destin: So, so that’s the back side of the film. So you don’t scratch it.
Matt: Exactly.
Destin: So on, on the roll, where’s the photosensitive part? It’s on the inside?
Matt: This is the emulsion. Yes. And this is a support.
Destin: Okay.
Matt: The outside of the support.
Destin: Gotcha.
Matt: So now I’d pull this knife off, there’d be a balance. I’d throw that out.
Destin: Okay.
Matt: And it keeps me from overlapping the film. So I butt that up to the knife. I’m going to reset it now. I take a piece of tape and you want it in the center of the film. You don’t want it being perforated.
Destin: Okay.
Matt: So now I’m going to take this.
Destin: You don’t want the tape to be perforated because it’ll mess up your punch.
Matt: It’s very, It could be. Our tape could get stuck on the heart and caused damage. There’s a number of things that could happen.
Destin: Gotcha.
Matt: So now I’ll take the slack out. And I’m going to send the film through.
Destin: Where should I be looking right now?
Matt: That’s well all this, you got. This arm moving. The film is going to kick through this end and it’s predetermined to make sure that I get the tape off so this this board comes out the knife will cut the film so that I have all the tape through the machine. Gotcha. And then this would be what we call a scratch test end. Every roll that we run, we’ll have a scratch test end that I would send to the tube system.
Destin: Matt: “Normally the door would close. So now I’m going to start the machine.”
Destin: “Got it.”
Matt: “So this is where it’s going to wind up. It’s going to unwind from the backend and it’s going to wind up here.”
Destin: “Okay, Sounds good.”
Matt: “It runs up to 3000 feet a minute.”
Destin: “That’s really fast. Did you run it on 100 feet per minute system?”
Matt: “I still do, some products. We still have to run that way.”
Destin: “Can you show me where the holes go?”
Matt: “Oh, you mean the perforation? This right here. And the spinning. So this is the actual punch drum this is the die drum.”
Destin: “Okay.”
Matt: “So as it rotates it’s pushing the perforations.”
Destin: “I see it right here.”
Matt: “Yeah. And the film that’s ejected goes into the heart and gets vacuumed out. Through this exhaust tube.”
Destin: “So. So if I had a high speed camera, I would see little holes of film going that way.”
Matt: “Yeah. Is this is clear. Yeah. You’d see the vacuum taking them out.”
Destin: “Is there a bucket of those holes somewhere?”
Matt: “Right around the wall I can show you after we’re done.”
Destin: “Okay. Sounds good. So can you. Can you run this? So we’re done.”
Matt: “Yeah. We slurped like a spaghetti noodle. We slurped the end of the film up right?”
Destin: “Exactly. Okay, so that that roll is done. So at this point, how do you take the core off?”
Matt: “Now, if this was actual production I wouldn’t. What would happen is, this arm right here. You see, there’s a core there. This arm comes down. It takes the empty core, comes back to the retracted position. While that’s going on the manipulator arm is bringing in my next full roll of film.”
Destin: “That’s awesome.”
Matt: “So, yeah, I don’t. I don’t touch anything on this end.”
Destin: “Gotcha.”
Matt: “It’s all automatic.”
Destin: “So what on this machine do you worry about? Is there something that typically messes up?”
Matt: “Uh, not usually.”
Destin: “That’s impressive. So how many of these do you guys have?”
Matt: “We have these two here, and then we have seven on the other side.”
Destin: “Seven on the other side. Yeah, we used to have 28, but because film isn’t quite as popular as it used to be, it’s picking back up.”
Matt: “No, I love it. I love it.”
Destin: “Do you like your job?”
Matt: “Oh, I love it. I love, I started 26 years ago and obviously going through all the changes we’ve gone through, I’m really surprised to still be here.”
Destin: “Yeah.”
Matt: “A lot of us never anticipated that with all the bad news you know.”
Destin: “Are you seeing production go up?”
Matt: “Yeah, it seems to be headed that way. Cause we were, actually been working some overtime. We hear about all the directors out in Hollywood. That still love film.”
Destin: “I still shoot film.”
Matt: “Yeah, no friends of mine. Same thing that when you go upstairs they still shoot 120 and, and I’m a big music fan so I still got record albums They’re coming back.”
Destin: “Oh yeah, isn’t it awesome?”
Matt: “yeah, it’s it’s really cool.”
Destin: “I love it.”
Matt: “Because I told guys, just because it’s new doesn’t mean it’s improved.”
Destin: _“I hear you! Can you show me the holes that come out of the film?” And then you’ve got the punches which are the same.So you’ve got 96 of those and then you’ve got the servo motors that drive it.

Dude! So that’s how much film we’ve run. That’s amazing. All of it, with all those little perforations. And that’s silver - there’s silver in that. Exactly. So we recycle it to recover the silver. So once it comes out here, it’s in the light. So this is you just - you just recycle the whole thing. Can I get a picture with you in there, Matt?

Oh, sure. [Shutter click]

So I’m sure he told you, right? That middle bit that’s actually making the perforations. We call that the heart, right? No, he didn’t tell me that. Okay, so I will say that the operator, Matt, he seemed to not have a big concern about that, which tells me that the engineers are doing their job right.

Yeah, there is a lot of technology going into developing that system right, 3000 feet a minute. It is not, not slow when you’re perforating at those speeds. There’s a lot of extra things that you have to start thinking about, right?

Okay. I mean, when you’re up at 3000 feet a minute, you’re thinking about harmonics now. Yes. Right, vibrations, harmonics, tensions are really important. So we’re actually sneaking through the maintenance shop here because we’ve got a lot of the hearts on display here. And here’s one kind of, kind of cut open.

Oh wow. Oh yeah. So, the face plate of the machines here and just this little bit is sticking out. Okay. And we’ve got all the hoses and stuff hooked up to the front here for the vacuums. And one reason why we nickname it the heart, because we have an oil mist in here. Okay. And when it’s running, it’s got the nice red oil flowing through it like a heart one.

Those are just straight involute teeth, aren’t they? Yep. That’s interesting. So can I sit down in this chair? Yes. And kind of engage with this. This is really, really high precision stuff.

Okay, so I’m seeing. So you’ve got set screws here. Yes. That are positioning each individual hole. Yeah. So the lower sets, they’re called the dies. And up at the top is the punches, right. So we’ve got a punch and die operation.

Can I turn it? Uhhh, yes. You think so? Yes. Okay, so. So I grab it here. Okay. That’s a free wheeler, so I should be able to. Yeah. Look at that. Okay, so. So this is just a one to one. Yup. I feel no mechanical interaction whatsoever. Nope, yeah so it’s actually a through hole.

So basically here’s my knife. So this hole has to move left and right up and down in order to index with the punch that corresponds with it. And is there, do you know how many there are on the wheel? 96. There’s 96. And so those are paired. Yep. And they’re tuned as a pair. Correct. How long does it take to tune them? Months. Months to tune one heart? Yep. Are you serious? Yes.

Well, I have so many things I want to ask you. Um, How is it driven? There’s a big motor out this way. Yep, Yep. So got a serve on the serve on the. Direct drive? Direct drive. Yeah. That’s incredible. I’m noticing the the slots on the inside. So you have a channel that has a vacuum in it. Yup. So you have maximized your vacuum surface area instead of having little holes, you actually distribute that vacuum over a whole lot of surface area and that is a precisely machined part. Incredibly. So that’s, that’s a monolithic piece, isn’t it? That ring.

Uh, every single die there is individual. Every die is individual. But the vacuum chamber is is all one big ring that’s right up there. Right on the drum. Yeah. So so there’s how many how many parts are just in this head.

Alright. So you get the die drum which is the, the thing that everything gets bolted to with the vacuum channels. And then you’ve got the a set, a set of die on each side all 96 around. Then you have the vacuum channel all the way around that. Yeah. And then you’ve got the punches which are the same. So you’ve got 96 of those and then you’ve got the servo motors that drive it. **Correct. Because it’s, it’s touching film now. Yup. You see these this kind of ring, light through. Yeah. That bringing light through there, that’s actually we hook up a vacuum. Right. Right to the center hub here and pull out all the It comes this way. Yep. Okay. And that’s that little hose that was on the front pulling it up and out. That’s amazing. So do you ever have jams in here? Because if you get. Because if this thing’s running super, super fast, what’s going to happen is if it gets on one side and you get a clump of them, you get what is a centrifugal force. It’ll sling it in there and you’ll get the washing machine effect. Yeah, yeah. Or they won’t want to come out. So you can’t put more in the hole and that’s an issue. Okay. And so then it gets imbalanced now. So that’s where the harmonics come in. I’m struggling to express how impressive this is to me. Like if you’ve ever designed anything, the idea of aligning all these posts to the dies and make this thing run at 3000 feet per minute, it’s incredible. Like, you have to make sure that you shear it, but you don’t make contact. And there’s hundreds of pieces in that assembly. This is very complicated. So what is this? So you’ll be able to look through through the microscope. You can’t film through the microscope. So you actually be able to see up through the die looking up at a perf. When you look through here, I look through the die. Look through the die up, up at up at a punch. So you’ve got to be careful because this is an active one being worked on so you can give it a little rocking back and forth too, if you want. Oh, wow. So you’re looking at the edges. Yeah. So that that’s how you’re you’re kind of going to use this tool to help set that up. Right, Because you really want to be looking at that alignment of of the punch to that die. Right. Because having it touch is really, really bad at 3000 feet a minute. Okay. So you’re looking at the backside of the punch. Yeah, we’re looking up through the die at the top of the punch. Got it. up at a punch. So you’re rocking that back and forth on this very important jig here. And you can throw this and slide it in and out as well. Yeah. You’re going want to look at the front, front perf back perf. Okay, so. Front punches back punches. Oh wow. So he’s actually got or she whoever’s doing this. Oh wow. So there’s some teeth or punch excuse me, Some punches have been removed and so they’re setting those and everything’s a special tool, isn’t it? Oh, yeah. That’s so cool. Everything’s a special tool. That’s amazing. Oh, and these are the fiber lights. I use these for schlieren. Okay. Just to see what’s going on. So what’s what’s happening here is someone who’s working on this is going through here. We’ve got the vacuum ring still there, and that’s on the non photo sensitive side, correct? Correct. That is on the backside of the film. The backside of the film. And so they’re going through one at a time. These threaded holes. They are putting they are putting perf holes in. Is that what they’re doing? Dies. The die. Excuse me. So that’s what a purple is called a die now. So they’re putting those dies in one at a time and they’re aligning them. Man. I’m just, I’m just now appreciating this part. This part has 96 sets of four threaded holes. So to kill that part is expensive. That’s a oh, that part right there cost tens of thousands of dollars. Oh, yeah. That’s amazing. These are all hearts. These are all hearts. Okay. Donovan showed me how to cut the big sheets down into strips, which will later become cans. We then walked around the corner and Donovan showed me a machine that was making the little metal end cap for film canisters. We put a hopper in down there and it’s taking them one at a time. Patrick showed us how to put the velvet on the strips, which is done upside down. The velvet has an adhesive on the back and is heated and glued onto the strip after it goes through some heaters. We then cut the velvet separately so it doesn’t get connected in between the strips. Destin: “Oh, that’s so strange.”
Patrick: “And then now since the velvets cut, we can use this press to where we’re just cutting the metal. So we’re actually got double dye sets there and we’re, we’re punching each of these strips separately, and then they’ll be indexed in these trays.”
Destin: “Yep.”
Patrick: “And that’s one of those trays. We have some loaded ones over there.”
Destin: “Okay.”
Patrick: “And that’s what we’re going to use over at the dial to actually form this into something we can use at the spooler.”
Destin: “So we’re gonna turn this into a can?”
Patrick: “Correct.”
Destin: “Down the hall after these things were velveted, cut and crimped, they’re being loaded into one of my favorite machines on the planet. This is what actually makes the can. Let’s watch it for a second, and then we’ll try to figure out what’s going on.”

[Metal scraping, click sound every rotation] [Metal tubes clicking together as they fall from the belt]

Destin: “Okay, So metal comes out here, goes down, comes here, and it rolls it into a cylinder.”
Patrick: “Yeah.”
Destin: “It moves over here. It grabs a cap. And then as it moves forward, it puts the cap on way back there.”
Patrick: “Yeah.”
Destin: “And then it, it’s crimps it on and then towards the back it stakes it. Is that right?”
Patrick: “Yeah.”
Destin: “So this is the stacker here. So once it brings the cap over, now it’s going to stake it and then the rest of it just this conveyor. So taking it off, deciding if its a reject or not to, cause we’re measuring how well we actually staking it onto the magazine.”
Destin: “Got it.”

[Machine sounds once again] [Hollow metal tubes clicking together as they drop]

Destin: “So good. It’s so good, dude.” [shutter click] “It’s so cool. Okay, We’ve made the film and we’ve made the can. It’s open on one side. We’ve only staked it on one side, but we have to put the film in the can and then we have to put it in this little container here. How do we do that?”

Patrick: “First all, we get the other side of the can and we get it oriented correctly. In a vibration rotation thing that gets it all aligned correctly. And then check this out. The little plastic canisters, they get them oriented correctly just by that little lip on the top, and they use gravity to drop it down.”
Destin: “I could watch this for days. The lids for those cans move up this little conveyor belt and there’s these little sensors that tell if the lid is oriented in the correct way or not. If it’s not, it kicks it out. Once all these components are oriented correctly, they then go through a light lock into the adjacent room where all of them come together in one complete package in a 35 millimeter film can.”

Destin: “So you’re Sermin?”
Sermin: “Sermin.”
Destin: “Nice to meet you.”
Sermin: “Nice to meet you too.”
Destin: “You run this machine.”
Sermin: “Yes, I do.”
Destin: “Do you mind showing me how it works?”
Sermin: “Okay, so this is the A cabinet.”
Destin: “Okay.”
Sermin: “So we hang the rolls like this. That’s all ready”
Destin: “Is that a B cabinet? You have two?”
Sermin: “Yes, we have two, we have A and B.”
Destin: “And so you can have two rolls on there to tie.”
Sermin: “That is auto splice”
Destin: “Auto splice.”

[Machine hissing air]

Destin: “Oh, I’m seeing these film caps. I recognize those.”
Sermin: “Oh, yeah.”
Destin: “Okay. So I’m seeing all the components.”
Patrick: “Yeah.”

Patrick: “They all come together here.”
Sermin: “That’s the magazine.”
Destin: “Got it. So you’re running Kodak Gold today?”
Sermin My name is Rich and I’m here to explain the final packaging process of 35 millimeter film. After the film can is placed in the plastic case, it is shot through a tube and up around the spooler. From there, it goes into a white line where the packaging lines are. The film then goes through the 3P package line, where it is packaged in a variety of formats. After that, it is inspected for damage and expiration and then put in a box with a label indicating how many packages are in the case. The case is then taped and stacked on a pallet. There is a metal detector at the end of the line to ensure that the cans are ferrous and that the right amount of film is present. [Op3] Yeah, everyone gets along.

If it has less than five items, the machine will stop and alert the individual to come to the station and remove it. It could be four or three, possibly due to a jam. After that, there is a top kicker that looks the same as the bottom kicker which bends the flap under. The left side actively closes and the right side hits the rail when it indexes. At the same time, the emulsion number and expiration date are printed on the carton. The emulsion number is printed on the side of the package and is glued in position at the next station. There is a spritz of glue on the top and bottom tab and the rails compress it together for a few seconds. It is then checked with lights on the top to ensure the flap is not up and ejected with a suction cup. The packaging operator inspects it and puts it in the box. The boxes are placed on the pallet with labels sticking out. The employee has been working there for four months and loves it, mentioning it is a good team project. He is the youngest there and is hoping to work his way up. Another employee has been there for 43 years and finds it enjoyable, mentioning everyone gets along. It was great meeting David and getting to learn about the Kodak plant in Rochester, New York. Rich was also an amazing help in my three hour tour and was kind enough to let me take a picture of him and his team. It was amazing to see the older generation teaching the younger generation, and the strength of American manufacturing. It made me feel really good and I’m grateful for the experience. I want to thank everyone who has supported Smarter Every Day on Patreon and encourage everyone to consider shooting some film. If you want to stay updated with my new videos, sign up for the email list at Smarter Every Day dot com. That’s it for now! Have a good one!